OGC and the Geo-Web

I'm pretty sure Raj Singh (whose path I somehow managed to never cross at OSG05), gets this already, but one of the things the OGC needs to understand before it can help to geo-enable the Web is that there's more to ubiquity than just dumbing down specifications to the grade level of the mass market. Systems with simple rules allow the evolution of complex and surprising features. Our teeming, expanding, World Wide Web was made possible by its deliberately simple design.

At the end of his post, Singh asks:

And finally a note about the name, Mass Market. I'm not in love with the name either. Don't hire me to name your next product. But what if we had called it the geoweb working group? Would I be getting flamed like Google did over that new geoweb layer in Earth?

As far as I could tell, the reaction against Google's geographic web layer came entirely from pro-OGC quarters, so I doubt that "OGC GeoWeb Working Group" would have sparked any flames.

Forget Mass Market, it's All About the Web

Returning from the OGC's Technical Committee meeting, Ed Parsons writes:

... OGC needs to embrace and recognize the needs of the mass market, as I pointed out in my presentation maybe there is now a new requirement for interoperability, above the levels of W*S services at the mapping API level.

Ed's right, although I would eliminate the wishy-washy "mass market" term, cut right to the chase, and rephrase the statement as:

The OGC needs to embrace and recognize the needs of the Web.

W*S protocols have opened minds and hinted at possibilities, but are not engendering a geo-web. Pictures and data flow dutifully through channels, but there is no evolution of linkage, no complex, organic patterns or structures, no sum that is bigger than its parts. There's no web here.

It's time for a new approach. It's time to geo-enable the Web.

Update: Jo has more on the subject. I agree, "Mass Market" is patronizing.

Comments

Re: Forget Mass Market, it's All About the Web.

Author: Paul Ramsey

Isn't the web geo-enabling itself just fine? The web runs about 10 times faster than the various members of the OGC, and the OGC exists to serve its members. If OGC is always playing catch-up, are they likely to ever be in the game at all?

Re: Forget Mass Market, it's All About the Web.

Author: Jason Birch

It's better than "Cheetah" :) Seriously, I think it's a sign of the traditional GIS "community" not fully understanding that there's been a paradigm shift in the last couple years. I do see the OGC as playing an important role for proprietary vendors and their products, and for large organisations wanting to implement to an accepted standard. It means that _eventually_ all of the platforms I have to support will get at least a reduced-functionality view of my information. Of course, if they have to wait for the standardisation process to complete in order to deliver features that the open source community is implementing immediately, it's a competitive disadvantage for these entities. Which is good for open source geospatial.... Jason

Re: Forget Mass Market, it's All About the Web.

Author: Ed Parsons

Jason, You are right the "traditional" industry has not recognised the changes of the last few years.. the challenge for OGC as an organsiation is to embrace the change - and time will tell if this is successful. ed

Re: Forget Mass Market, it's All About the Web.

Author: Sean

Thanks for the comments. I forgot to mention that the open source GIS community needs to change its tack as well. Instead of pushing the OGC protocols -- which are only about geo-enabling enterprises -- out onto the Web, we should be exploring better methods that go with the grain of the Web. The tiling spec that Paul is pushing forward is a great start, and I'd like to see it (or something like it) displace WMS and WMS-C (for caching) on the World Wide Web.

Biggest and Best of 2006

Here's my list of some of the biggest and best of the community, blogosphere, and things tangential in the last 12 months, in no particular order, and with no apologies about the open source bias. I've omitted many worthy persons, events, and developments. Feel free to write about them in comments or on your own blog. You may be surprised at how long it takes you to make even deliberately casual, non-definitive, best-of lists.

Comments

Re: Biggest and Best of 2006

Author: Andy

Whatever happened with the Mapserver Cheeta thing? Once Autodesk put it's hands into it I dropped my list subsrciptions and haven't followed Mapserver since. Is it safe to come back now or is it still a fiasco? I still can't believe DM Solutions, Steve Lime, or Frank for that matter thought that would be an OK thing to do.

Re: Biggest and Best of 2006

Author: Sean

Andy, they agreed to agree that it never happened. Down the memory hole. Things are pretty much back to normal, except that MapServer has lost some momentum. If you miss MapServer, you should jump back in.

Re: Biggest and Best of 2006

Author: Andy

I'll look into it. I still follow OGR, GDAL, and PROJ fairly closely along with MITAB and Shapelib but this Mapserver thing really put a bad taste in my mouth for using the Mapserver technology again. I mean they let one of the biggest Open Source opponents come in and directly make a grab for the project if they did that once who is to say they won't do it again then next time a big company comes in waving a lot of money and promises around?

NBA Geography

My old hometown Jazz routed the Mavericks last night for Jerry Sloan's 1000th win. For now -- and for the first time in my memory -- the Mountain West, led by the Phoenix Suns, Utah Jazz, and Denver Nuggets, is the NBA's dominant geographic region.

Comments

Re: NBA Geography

Author: James Fee

Of course we know at the end of the season the Suns will be dominant, but I'm not sold on the Jazz just yet. The Nuggs are a whole different story, but I'm rooting for them.

Re: NBA Geography

Author: Sean

I'm getting nervous about these Iverson rumors. I like his game, but man, the cost, and the Nuggets already have a great complement for Anthony in J.R. Smith.

The Fuss About Google's Geographic Web

I don't see the point in fussing about Google's new geographic web layer. ESRI's Geography Network and the scattered archipelago of W*S servers may have come first, but neither constitute a functioning web. Google's geo web is as legitimate as any other.

QGIS R-Trees

I too looked into Hadjieleftheriou's Spatial Index Library before settling on shapelib's quad tree (for Quadtree). My C++ chops are a bit flabby these days, and Frank's C code is very easy to work with. Given my limited time and minimal requirements, the choice was obvious. Now, I'll definitely be looking into the QGIS R-tree implementation.

The MapGuide Demos

Jason Birch points out new MapGuide Open Source demos that beg to be compared against the ArcGIS Server ADF demos. I spent a few minutes trying out the three generic tasks and must say, this is more like it. Autodesk is employing some UI and graphic designers. They haven't found the sweet spots yet, but are closer than the ADF team. They need to drastically reduce the number of mouse clicks needed to theme a layer -- the color picker is particularly painful to use. The markup task is poorly named (HTML is markup), and almost useless. The larger goal is to share placemarks (or lines, or polygons) with other users across applications. Why jail them inside MapGuide? The feature query task ought to support more complex multi-property queries, and the polygon digitization tool is a nightmare (The ADF's performs much better).

The browser swamp is a rough home for GIS applications. One of the keys to success is putting swamp dwellers to work on an application. In theory, MapGuide Open Source has the edge: there aren't any proprietary barriers to the participation of a PHP or Javascript savant. I suspect that ESRI prefers to retrain its desktop developers for swamp duty. (This suspicion is based on an article -- which I found via Jeff Thurston, and can not now find at all -- where an ESRI technical lead spoke about the pressing need for strong typing in Javascript.) I'm betting on the swamp dwellers.

Comments

Re: The MapGuide Demos

Author: Jason Birch

I wouldn't spend too much time looking at the UI for those samples; they're primarily meant as API examples that developers can use to build truly useful applications. Personally, I'm tossing the default UI and using Fusion (based on Chameleon) instead. This will allow me to make poor UI decisions and take personal responsibility for them :) The important part (to me) is that all of the functionality that is behind those samples is part of the native MapGuide API. It's still a bit early in its life, and there aren't many real world apps out there yet, but I can't wait to see what kinds of things people do with MapGuide as it picks up steam. Not that I'm biased or anything... Jason